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PostPosted: Mon Nov 12, 2012 2:54 pm 
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Parallels between Mesoamerican and Middle Eastern/Egyptian Religion and Mythology

In preparation for my trip to the Yucatan, I am revisiting themes found in the chapter in The Christ Conspiracy entitled, "Evidence of an Ancient Global Civilization." In my Christ Con revision, I have removed that chapter, as it merits a monograph of its own, one I have titled The Lost Religion. Because of scientific discoveries and techniques developed since my book was published in 1999, there are some issues in this "Global Civilization" chapter that need to be updated. Specifically, analyses of DNA and disease spread need to be included in our quest to determine how the parallels raised in Christ Con and elsewhere ended up in both hemispheres, i.e., the Old and New Worlds.

Without going into detailed discussion of isolationism and diffusionism here, I wanted to share some of the research I've been encountering in the works of Diane E. Wirth, a Harvard-educated Mormon scholar. I have previously excerpted one of her articles, in a Mormon journal, in which she attempts to "prove" that the Book of Mormon could be true, with its diffusionism of culture from the Middle East to the Americas. In her extraordinary book Parallels: Mesoamerican and Ancient Middle Eastern Traditions, Wirth does not raise Mormonism but, rather, provides a tremendous amount of well-researched and considered commonalities between Mesoamerican (Maya, Aztec, et al.) and Middle Eastern/Egyptian religion and mythology. While it could be argued, perhaps, that she has stretched a few of the numerous points she has brought to light, the entire corpus is striking.

It should be noted that, while some professional Mesoamerican archaeologists and Mayanists declare that "there are no close correspondences" between these Old and New World cultures, others have stated, for example, "A person, no matter how skeptical, would be silly to deny the similarities in some of traditional Asian and Native American art." (That comment came from a famous archaeologist renowned for his skeptical analyses and isolationism.) The same can be said concerning the architecture and religion, when these are studied in depth. I will not discuss the architecture here, but there are some good studies by Indian architects that demonstrate parallels between Mesoamerican structures and later Indian architecture. The shared fondness of pyramids in areas globally is obvious, with such edifices representing the "Holy Mountain" concept, a notion that could emerge naturally in the minds of people in different parts of the world, without any diffusionism, one supposes. However, a close study may reveal that certain building principles correspond closely enough for even these "natural" building practices to have emanated from one source.

In any event, here I list various parallels between the Mesoamerican and Middle Eastern/Egyptian religion and mythology, as can be found in Wirth's book Parallels. Throughout the book, Wirth clarifies that the question is open as to how these correspondences could have come about, but the similarities are too many and too detailed to deny that they exist. On p. 161, concerning the parallels she is about to introduce, following numerous others in previous chapters, Wirth remarks:

Quote:
This chapter contains individual similarities between Mesoamerica and the Near East that are not always part of a larger complex. As with other seemingly plausible connections, they may have developed in isolation, been the result of the human psyche, or brought to the New World via the process of cultural diffusionism. These traditions are presented here in hope that further study and/or discoveries will determine the answers.

The above sentiment should be kept in mind as we delve into these many correspondences, a certain percentage of which is included here. I also will not speculate here as to how these parallels came about, since such an analysis would be very lengthy and will be the goal of The Lost Religion book, which may not be forthcoming for several years. The following list is compiled from Wirth's book, on p. 5 of which she remarks:

Quote:
The many similarities in symbols and traditions of all ancient cultures call for serious investigation. Those that prove to be exactly the same - oceans apart - cannot always be attributed to coincidence, isolation or human psychological unity.

In this list, I have not included any of the other correspondences, such as between Quetzalcoatl/Kukulkan and Christ, that can be found elsewhere and that are also extensive.

Religious, Mythological, Ritual and Other Cultural Correspondences between the Old and New Worlds

• Bearded “Semitic” men depicted on stelae
• Gods on crosses
• Cross as a sacred symbol
• Dying and resurrected or reborn grain gods arising out of the underworld/ground
• Gods’ body parts hung on a tree
• Creation myths
• Defeat of a father’s murderer
• Slaying a monster to create the world
• Creation via a god speaking “the Word”
• Concept of order out of chaos
• Gods, heroes and Orion
• Gods whose bones are ground before being resurrected
• Sun and moon as twin gods, heroes or eyes of a god or gods
• Religious organizations with priests and building dedications
• Councils of gods
• New Year ceremonies
• Kindling the yearly “New Fire”
• Stretching the cord of the four directions
• Ritual processions
• Purification and baptism
• 365-day year consisting of 360 plus five “empty” days added to the end
• Raising of the “World Tree”
• Rebirth and renewal of the king
• Sacrifice as renewal of life
• Fish symbolizing birth and rebirth
• Gods as fishermen
• Fish and grain myths
• King lists
• Symbolism in genealogies
• Ancestor veneration
• King as divine or servant of God(s)
• Sacrifice of the sacred king proxy
• King as guardian and gardener
• First man/first father myths
• King as axis mundi
• King as the World Tree
• Pillars of the cosmos
• Sacrifice of the tree
• Milky Way as the sacred tree of life
• World Tree of Life as a cross
• Serpent worship
• Supernatural or divine scribes
• Scribal practices in common
• Cardinal point myths
• Wombs of Earth and Sky
• Uterine symbolism
• Emergence from caves myths
• Winged sun disc glyphs
• Moon goddess myths
• Seeded earth symbolism
• Tree of Life as mother
• Earth separated from the sky by a divine figure holding up the latter while standing on the former
• Primordial mound of creation/mountain
• Primordial waters of creation
• Temples or other sacred sites flooded with creation waters
• Nine Lords of the Underworld
• Dog as the guide to the underworld
• Deceased as stars
• Field of Reeds as point of creation
• Wheeled funerary objects
• Incense and horned altars
• Images of victors standing or sitting on the backs of vanquished
• Banners as symbols of divinity
• Depictions of rulers grasping captives by hair, about to strike
• Images of captives with jaws removed
• Flower ear ornaments
• Decapitation/dismemberment of the grain god

It should be noted that, in Wirth's book, each of these subjects is fleshed out with details that increase the similarities, meaning that these parallels are not simply vague.

Nine Lords of the Underworld

One of the most striking of these parallels because of such detail and specificity is the tradition of "Nine Lords of the Underworld," about which Wirth (161) remarks:

Quote:
A fragment of a Babylonian text mentions the Nine Gods of the Night. Their names were pronounced by priests and nine incense-burning censers were placed in their honor. An important Egyptian classification of gods mentioned in the early Pyramid Texts is the Ennead, which is comprised of [sic] nine gods who presided in the Underworld. To the Egyptians the number nine encompassed the meaning of totality. In a scene referred to as the Judgment Hall of Osiris, according to The Book of the Dead, the deceased is told that in the Field of Reeds he will receive barley and emmer, and will become as strong as when he lived on the earth. More particularly, the deceased will be able to do what he wishes like the nine gods of the Duat (the Underworld).

The same concept is found in Mesoamerica. However, instead of calling these nine supernatural beings gods, scholars frequently refer to them as the Nine Lords of the Night. Nine, in and of itself, can represent the number of the Earth Lord and/or the Underworld. In Maya cosmology there were thirteen layers to the heavens and nine layers in the Underworld, with some variation at times depending on the locale. Not only are many Mesoamerican pyramids constructed with nine levels, but Coggins suggests the nine doorway structures on a pyramid at Tikal represent this Underworld link.

Combined with the numerous correspondences previously listed, as well as those concerning Quetzalcoatl/Kukulkan, as also explicated upon by Wirth in her paper "Quetzalcoatl, the Maya Maize God, and Jesus Christ," it would appear that this parallel of the nine gods/lords of the night/underworlds could not possibly have evolved in isolation or spontaneously from the human mind. The suggestion of utter spontaneity or mass human psyche producing these numerous detailed correspondences seems itself to represent a mystical "solution" to the problem akin to "the Lord works in mysterious ways."

In any event, as I say, how this bizarre and fascinating conundrum came to be will be the subject of my forthcoming volume on the "lost religion." As the skeptical archaeologist says, it would be silly to deny these close correspondences. I highly recommend obtain Wirth's book Parallels to any student or scholar of comparative religion and mythology.

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In her "Epilogue," Wirth remarks the following.

Quote:
Mainstream isolationists demand extremely high levels of substantiation for theories supporting cultural inter-hemispheric diffusion. Anything less will not pose a threat to the prevailing traditional view that no contact across the oceans occurred. For the most part, the refusal to accept any idea that overseas contacts with Mesoamerica ever occurred has discouraged the airing of alternative explanations at university symposiums sponsored by departments of archaeology and anthropology, in professional journals, and especially in university publications. As discussed in the Introduction of this book, the majority of doctoral-level anthropology and archaeology graduates have gone on to teach the theories they learned as the basics of their fields. As a result, most students of Mesoamerican studies are simply not of a mind to vary from the established theories they were taught at their universities.

Inflexibility

Cyrus Gordon, a distinguished scholar of Near Eastern studies, with more than 600 publications to his credit, once met Ales Hrdlika, an influential dean of American archaeology. Gordon writes of Hrdlika's opposition to diffusionism and his unyielding position on this subject.

Quote:
His dogma was that Old World man entered pre-Columbian America by only one route: across the Bering Strait. Unless a young anthropologist subscribed to that view, it was virtually impossible for him to get a museum or university job in American anthropology or archaeology. This explains some of the inflexibility in that field down to the present.

Further Reading

Our Lord and Savior Quetzalcoatl
Maya watchtowers discovered to align with solstices and equinoxes
Quetzalcoatl/Kukulkan and Christ
Parallels: Mesoamerican and Ancient Middle Eastern Traditions
Master Builder Uncovers Striking Similarities In Indian and Incan/Mayan Sacred Structures
The Mayans and The Milky Way (radio show)

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PostPosted: Tue Nov 13, 2012 3:28 am 
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Acharya wrote:
Parallels between Mesoamerican and Middle Eastern/Egyptian Religion and Mythology

It should be noted that, while some professional Mesoamerican archaeologists and Mayanists declare that "there are no close correspondences" between these Old and New World cultures, others have stated, for example, "A person, no matter how skeptical, would be silly to deny the similarities in some of traditional Asian and Native American art." (That comment came from a famous archaeologist renowned for his skeptical analyses and isolationism.) The same can be said concerning the architecture and religion, when these are studied in depth. I will not discuss the architecture here, but there are some good studies by Indian architects that demonstrate parallels between Mesoamerican structures and later Indian architecture. The shared fondness of pyramids in areas globally is obvious, with such edifices representing the "Holy Mountain" concept, a notion that could emerge naturally in the minds of people in different parts of the world, without any diffusionism, one supposes. However, a close study may reveal that certain building principles correspond closely enough for even these "natural" building practices to have emanated from one source.



In all Vedic literature, the Mayan architecture is quoted with much admiration and it is quite obvious that they were outside India and their architecture had to imported at a hefty cost. Although Mayan is always referred to as an Asura, the fact that the Mahabharatha mentions him would indicate that the term is used more in a geographical sense (meaning beginning with Iranians all people to the west of Indus) and not as a 'bad guy' which is what the later puranic literature imply about the asuras. But whether the 'west' in the minds of the Indian writers extended right up to the American continents is a debatable issue and sounds quite far fetched. The other alternative would be that the native Americans were of Eurasian/ African origin and some kind of migration would have taken place.

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Janani Janmabhoomishcha Swargadapi Gareeyasi - Being near to your mother in your motherland is better than being in paradise

Ekavarnam yatha dugdham binnavarnasu dhenushu | tataiva dharmavaichitryam tatvam ekam param smritam ||
Just as milk is of only one colour though obtained from cows of different colours so also the peculiarities of different religious thoughts lead to the same one ultimate truth - Mahabharatha


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PostPosted: Mon Nov 26, 2012 10:50 pm 
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Olmec Colossal 'Black' Heads Mystery Solved?

One of the great mysteries of Mesoamerican archaeology is the existence of massive sculpted heads of Olmec natives with seemingly "negroid" features. Because of their peculiar features, these enormous carved basalt heads have been a favorite of diffusionism enthusiasts who wonder if these sculptures may represent Africans who made it to the Americas in pre-Columbian times, a comparison I included in the first edition of The Christ Conspiracy. The heads were carved during the pre-Maya Olmec period, around 1500 to 300 BCE, and depict men with flat, wide noses and full lips, as well as what appears to be a helmet. Because of these "black" features, not a few researchers have averred these impressive sculptures, of which at least 17 have been found, serve as evidence of pre-Columbian trans-Atlantic journeys bringing Africans to the Americas.

Image

Superficially, the arguments are intriguing, but the first objection is that it would be unusual for a native culture to spend so much time creating images of another, foreign race, unless subjugated by it. There is no hardcore, scientific evidence of any such subjugation or even the arrival in Central America of Africans in remote history or pre-history. There are rumors of occasional black tribes when the Spanish arrived, but no solid proof such as physical remains or distinct artifacts, and DNA studies thus far have not demonstrated any presence of Africans in the region.

Out of Africa?

Regarding these heads, in Encyclopedia of Dubious Archaeology (201), anthropologist Dr. Ken Feder comments:

Quote:
The Olmec Colossal Heads are, exactly as their name describes, colossal sculptures made of basalt, a volcanic rock, carved into the form of human heads and faces. The heads were made between 3,200 and 2,900 years ago by the Olmec, the earliest civilization in Mesoamerica....

Though there is no controversy among Mesoamericanists about the heads, Ivan van Sertima maintains that the faces depicted in the sculptures are all African. He bases this claim on three facts:

1. The stone used to sculpt the heads is black.
2. The noses of the heads are broad and flat.
3. The lips of the sculpted faces are broad and thick.

In other words, on the basis of little more than eyeballing the sculptures, van Sertima concludes that the Olmec rulers were migrants from Africa and takes this to mean that the earliest civilization in Mesoamerica was inspired by pre-Columbian African visitors and settlers of the New World.

To be fair, van Sertima is not the first scholar to note a similarity between the faces depicted on the Olmec heads (and in other Olmec representations of human faces) and those of people of African origin...

[This] conclusion [is] based on little of evidentiary value. The black color of the sculptures is meaningless: black is the color of the readily available, durable volcanic stone that abounds in Olmec territory, and it bears little resemblance to the actual skin color of people of African descent. Further, not all of the raw material actually was black; at least one of the heads is made from a white raw material. Beyond this, if we are going to rely on morphological features to determine the continent of origin of the models for the sculptures, it must be pointed out that the heads show flat facial profiles, similar to the profiles of Native Americans and quite different from the commonly prognathous profile (the lower face thrust out from the upper) of people of African descent. Finally, a close examination of the sculptures shows what appears to be a skin fold in the eyelids, seeming to depict the epicanthic fold typical of Asian and New World native people.

There is no evidence for the presence of African migrants to the New World before Columbus. No artifacts have been found whose raw material sources can be traced to Africa; no artifacts whose style could only come from a pre-Columbian African source have been found in the New World; and finally, no skeletal remains have been found, dating to a pre-Columbian context, with DNA proving an African source....

In any event, there is no space here to go into the diffusionism versus isolationism debate in full. What is of interest here is an apparent solution to the "problem" of the colossal Olmec heads. Before we arrive at this conclusion, provided by history of religions professor Dr. Karl W. Luckert, in his book Olmec Religion (University of Oklahoma Press, 1976), we need to look at Luckert's case for the Olmec serving significantly as serpent-worshippers.

A Jaguar or Serpent Cult?

It should be noted that archaeologists previously have surmised that the Olmec heads represent humans who have been given jaguar features, like the "were-jaguar" of Mesoamerican mythology and iconography.

Image
A stone Olmec were-jaguar, showing common were-jaguar characteristics including a downturned mouth

However, in this book, Luckert argues against this interpretation and lays out the evidence that Olmec art depicts volcanoes as serpent heads belching out rich soil, from which grew the all-important maize/corn plants. The maize shoot itself is split into two forks, resembling a serpent's tongue, while the corn kernels appeared to be scales. It appears that, religiously and spiritually speaking, the maize and serpent were intertwined, along with the volcano and its basalt. The stones tossed out from these volcanoes, of course, were used to carve these massive heads. The Olmecs evidently believed, as did the Maya, that they themselves were made out of maize and therefore one with the plant and its permutations and associates. Moreover, as we know, the later Maya and Aztecs developed a popular cult of the "Feathered Serpent," called Quetzalcoatl, Kukulkan, Gugumatz, etc., also found at the Olmec site of La Venta. All in all, Luckert argues, what we appear to be looking at is a volcano-serpent-maize cult that constructed edifices such as pyramids representing the "primordial mountain" or volcano and then decorated them to commemorate this important belief system.

In this regard, it would appear that the Olmec identified themselves with and as serpents, especially the males, for obvious phallic reasons. Hence, the "helmeted negroid" carvings are in reality the faces of native Olmecs/pre-Maya people with features exaggerated in order to make them appear more serpentine, with the "helmets" in reality representing snake scales.

Image
Monument 4 head at La Venta

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Veracruz native Mario Gutierrez, a famous jockey

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Mayan elder Hunbatz Men (Copal, Mexico)

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Artist's rendering of an Olmec face with what resembles a snake head on top

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Back of Monument 4 head at La Venta showing possible snake scales

I find this solution to be satisfying in many respects, and I aver that this purported piece of "evidence" of diffusionism must be retired, whether or not the serpent thesis is correct as opposed to the were-jaguar interpretation, etc. (This fact does not mean I am closed to all diffusionist thought. I have many questions left, especially as concerns the seemingly uncanny resemblances between many Old and New World religious ideas, myths and rituals, as highlighted above.)

I have noted that the Wiki article on the Olmec heads makes nary a mention of Luckert's serpent solution. At the beginning of his book (ix), Luckert himself complains that historians of religions have been left out of the Mesoamerican-studies loop:

Quote:
Ever since I have become associated with history of religions I have noticed among my colleagues and friends a certain hesitancy in dealing with Middle American subject matters. My own response to Middle American religions was for many years one of helpless bewilderment. The categories of art and culture historians, useful as they may be for their specific purposes, have remained conspicuously barren for history-of-religions interpretations. Thus, with a background in the general history-of-religions field, I cannot boast of much specialized preparation in Middle American studies.

As we can see, not much has changed in the nearly four decades since Luckert wrote those words, as historians of religion continue to be left out of the equation. There seems to be some phobia of bringing comparative religion into the mix, even though we all supposedly share the same DNA and commonalities in many other fields, and would naturally have been engaging in religion all along the way out of Africa, not something that would stop during the thousands of years on the way to the Americas.

The question is, therefore, what the Mesoamerican peoples brought with them when they arrived in the Americas and what was developed and accreted afterwards. The unique Mesoamerican imagery represents expression using local flora, fauna and other features, such as the mundane and celestial landscapes, but there is undoubtedly an underlying structure of beliefs brought with them as they traveled through Beringia and down into Central America, as well as during possible later points of contact.

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PostPosted: Sun Apr 28, 2013 2:02 pm 
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Old and New World Parallels

Here is a new blog post:

Oldest Maya solar observatory and parallels between Old and New World cultures

Of relevance here is the modification of the "ancient global civilization" theory I discussed in the first edition of Christ Con. It is for the reasons I cite in this new essay that I am removing this chapter in CC and eventually publishing a monograph on the subject, which is prompted by the plethora of correspondences between Old and New World religion and mythology.

Quote:
The reasons for the amazing correspondences are complex, but the chances that they derive from pre-Columbian diffusionism are actually slim to none. In my book The Christ Conspiracy, I delve into the idea of a global civilization in antiquity that spread these ideas. However, since the time of publication in 1999, science has made great strides on this question, from the perspective of DNA and disease studies in particular, as well as species migration studies, as with invasive plants and animals.

Because we simply have no hard scientific evidence of any sort of large-scale and sustained diffusionism of "Old World" ideas (or species) to the "New World," after the early migrations across the Bering Land Bridge and before Columbus, most of these parallels must have been developed as part of humankind's natural thought processes. This latter contention is logical, because the human brain in general operates the same way, wherever it may be found, just as do other species, even though they may possess variants. For example, birds and dogs may differ widely in looks and size, beak/muzzle shape, and so on, but they have the same basic body type, instincts and needs. The bottom line is that, if a human being can think of something once in one part of the world, straight "out of the blue," then another human being can have the same thought elsewhere, likewise "out of the blue" and independently.

This clarification should be added to the "errata" already compiled for the first edition of Christ Con.

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PostPosted: Sat May 04, 2013 9:20 pm 
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Quote:
Out of Africa?

Regarding these heads, in Encyclopedia of Dubious Archaeology (201), anthropologist Dr. Ken Feder comments:

Quote:
The Olmec Colossal Heads are, exactly as their name describes, colossal sculptures made of basalt, a volcanic rock, carved into the form of human heads and faces. The heads were made between 3,200 and 2,900 years ago by the Olmec, the earliest civilization in Mesoamerica....

Though there is no controversy among Mesoamericanists about the heads, Ivan van Sertima maintains that the faces depicted in the sculptures are all African. He bases this claim on three facts:

1. The stone used to sculpt the heads is black.
2. The noses of the heads are broad and flat.
3. The lips of the sculpted faces are broad and thick.

In other words, on the basis of little more than eyeballing the sculptures, van Sertima concludes that the Olmec rulers were migrants from Africa and takes this to mean that the earliest civilization in Mesoamerica was inspired by pre-Columbian African visitors and settlers of the New World.

To be fair, van Sertima is not the first scholar to note a similarity between the faces depicted on the Olmec heads (and in other Olmec representations of human faces) and those of people of African origin...

[This] conclusion [is] based on little of evidentiary value. The black color of the sculptures is meaningless: black is the color of the readily available, durable volcanic stone that abounds in Olmec territory, and it bears little resemblance to the actual skin color of people of African descent. Further, not all of the raw material actually was black; at least one of the heads is made from a white raw material. Beyond this, if we are going to rely on morphological features to determine the continent of origin of the models for the sculptures, it must be pointed out that the heads show flat facial profiles, similar to the profiles of Native Americans and quite different from the commonly prognathous profile (the lower face thrust out from the upper) of people of African descent. Finally, a close examination of the sculptures shows what appears to be a skin fold in the eyelids, seeming to depict the epicanthic fold typical of Asian and New World native people.

There is no evidence for the presence of African migrants to the New World before Columbus. No artifacts have been found whose raw material sources can be traced to Africa; no artifacts whose style could only come from a pre-Columbian African source have been found in the New World; and finally, no skeletal remains have been found, dating to a pre-Columbian context, with DNA proving an African source....


Dr. Ken Feder from this extract is talking absolute rubbish! I assume he provides references to the actual pages in which Dr Ivan Van Sertima is alleged to be making these claims. Before going further, let me say that I own the two books in question. The titles are :

1. They Came Before Columbus [1976]
2. Early America Revisited [1998]

From [Early America Revisited] page 153 - Interview for "Our Time"(Part Two) by David Greaves New York, 1997

Quote:
DG: Your critics claim that you said African-Egyptians founded the Olmec civilization.

IVS: That is a naked and nasty lie. I have never said that so. The native Americans created their own civilization. I pointed to contact with Old World peoples, in this case, the Egypto-Nubian. I demonstrated a number of remarkable coincidences between their ritual complexes and a few of their technological developments.....


DG: What of the Olmec stone heads?

IVS: About a dozen of these have been found.Now, I want to make it clear at the outset of this discussion that not all of these are foreign types. I lived among the native Americans for the first twelve years of my life...De Montellano, chief of my critics, claims that all the stone heads are "spitting images of the native American". I do not like to attack my critics personally. Arguments should be met with arguments. But I have to say that in this case, this man is either blind or a bigot......

IVS: .....Here comes our infamous detractor, Bernard Ortiz de Montellano, "the little man with the big name," claiming that these stone heads only seemed to be of "black" people because they were made of dark volcanic stone. Then he goes on to say that they sometimes used white stone but it turned black over time............[read what Dr. Feder said above and read here again]



Dr. Van Sertima was initially skeptical about claims that Africans had visited America before Columbus...I will let him speak..
Quote:
I saw three green books- Africa and the Discovery of America by Leo Wiener. He was a German-American professor. I opened the first book of the trilogy and started reading. I was extremely skeptical. Africans in America before Columbus? This man must be crazy.........A thesis as revolutionary as this could not stand alone on the fragile pillars of philology ....page 147 - Early America Revisited


I will stand in the middle of the tree here and say categorically that Dr. Feder has NOT read the two books above.He attributes assertions to Dr. Van Sertima that were never uttered by Van Sertima but by his critic[De Montellano]. Please Dr. Feder tell us where Dr Van Sertima said what you claimed he said! Sources please?

A mantra that is worth repeating for would be critics and commentators:

Quote:
Read the books for yourselves. Then read criticisms of his work and see if those criticisms hold any water.


Many of the critics to whom Van Sertima responded to are cited in the Wikpedia article on him:
see section entitled "Reception"

Quote:
There is even some comparative religion in Early America Revisited: see pages 102 - 107


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A parting quote that will resonate with many here
Quote:
They talk about "dated sources," not realizing that one does not cite a source because one thinks it is gospel but because more often than not, the particular fact one is quoting from the dated source has been crosschecked against current knowledge - page 71, Early America Revisited.


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PostPosted: Tue Jul 23, 2013 1:22 pm 
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The Quest for the Mythical Jesus

On the Bible Geek group on Facebook, someone commented to the effect that we "still haven't proved Jesus didn't exist." Following are comments I posted on FB in response that I wanted to preserve.

The question is not whether or not a Jesus existed in antiquity. Many Jesuses existed in antiquity - there are some 20 of them in Josephus alone.

The factual statement in my opinion - proved beyond a shadow of a doubt - is that the "Jesus Christ" of the New Testament is a fictional composite of characters. A composite of multiple "people" is no one. When the mythological and midrashic layers are removed, there remains no historical core to the onion.

In my mind, we are well past the stage of demonstrating - proving - those facts, and there remains no debate. Now that we are past this erroneous perception that the question is "Jesus did exist?", we can move onto what the Christ MYTH actually means.

In this regard, I have provided reams of data from thousands of years ago from primary sources in multiple languages. The gospel story is clearly MYTH, as is its main figure.

If one actually studies ancient mythology in depth for decades, as I have, one can see quite readily the very ancient pre-Christian myths that were utilized in the creation of the Christ myth.

You can start here for the basic archetypes:

http://truthbeknown.com/christconspiracy.html

I have thousands of more pages, including in the new Moses book. Moses too is without a shadow of doubt a mythical composite. The myth was first and was historicized, not the other way around.

Let me provide another example of how knowledge of mythology and previous cultures is important in recognizing what we are really looking at in the gospel story.

In the gospel story appears a discussion of whether or not the disciples should take a "staff" or "rod" with them. The two gospels in which this episode appears, Mark (6:8) and Luke (9:3) contradict each other as to whether or not to take a staff with them.

One may not think much of this brief episode, the nonhistoricity of which is indicated by this contradiction. One might even consider that, despite the error, this detail indicates the gospel story is historical.

However, if one studies the Greek word used to describe this "staff," ῥάβδος rhabdos, one discovers that it is the same term employed by several ancient authorities to depict the staff/rod of the god Hermes, as well as that of Dionysus and his followers.

In such an instance, we can see that ancient Greek speakers immediately would have an impression in mind when this word, ῥάβδος rhabdos, is associated with a divinity, as in the case of the Greek gods and Jesus.

Moreover, since Dionysus's disciples - widespread in his very popular cult - were famous for carrying around just such a staff/rod, one can see instantly why this motif would be included in the gospel story.

As we have proved essentially, Christianity was created in order to roll the various religions, sects, cults and philosophies of the Roman Empire into one, and incorporating one of the most popular cults, that of Bacchus, would be crucial in this effort.

Hence, this small detail of the disciples and their staffs serves not as an element of a true story but has to do with acknowledging and appealing to the followers of Dionysus, who were many and included wealthy Jewish and Roman elite, such as several emperors.

There would be no Christianity had not the followers of Dionysus been incorporated in this manner. Hence, also the central focus of wine as the god's "blood," an attribute from very ancient times in the solar-wine cult.

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PostPosted: Tue Jul 23, 2013 1:31 pm 
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Now that I am in here, I see Nat's post above. These commonalities in culture are not from any significant possible post-Beringian contact. As I've stated previously in a number of articles, there may have been very slight and accidental contact, but it leaves no real trace. No diseases, no introduction of invasive species, little if any discernible DNA.

The commonalities of culture are explainable, and I have done so, again in many other posts and articles. This entire thread is about those commonalities, and I have provided explanations for them all along the way. The bottom line is that most of these ideas are natural to the human mind and are based on their environment. Some of these parallels may have been carried along the way out of Africa tens of thousands of years ago. I consider in this category to be those natural observations of celestial bodies such as the sun, moon, planets and stars, etc. The myths concerning these celestial bodies will change depending on the location, latitude and longitude, and so on. The sacred mountain point-of-origin myth appears to be another one that may have emanated out of Africa and been taken with humanity as it traveled around, as does the Tree of Life notion and the cross represents the four directions.

But these later contacts imagined by post-Beringian diffusionists simply are not evidenced in the hard scientific record.

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PostPosted: Thu Jul 25, 2013 4:41 pm 
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The Canaanite God the Father, Virgin Mother and Son

While researching for my Moses book, I keep coming across one juicy tidbit after another, many of which have to do not with the Old Testament but with the New. Naturally, I cannot pass up these factoids and must include them in my Moses book, which is swelling to a barely manageable size. Right now, in addition to the over 350 pages of text, I have 100 pages of bibliography and appendices alone! And that's 8.5 x 11" pages. :shock:

In any event, every time I plant my spade, I come across a new treasure trove, so it's taking a looong time. Here's another case in point: The Canaanite/Ugaritic and proto-Israelite mythology is chockablock with precedents for biblical ideas.

Along with inferences of the Moses and Exodus myths, the Canaanite texts describe the high god El, who has two wives, Asherah and Anat, the latter of whom is referred to repeatedly as the "Virgin Anat." These wives bear El two sons, Shahar and Shalim, the morning and evening aspects of Venus, respectively. Hence, the sons of El are equivalent to the one son of Yahweh, Jesus, called the "morning star" in the biblical book of Revelation (2:28, 22:16). (2 Peter 1:19 refers to φωσφόρος phōsphoros, translated as the "morning star.") Thus, we have a God the Father of the Morning Star over 1000 years before Jesus supposedly walked the earth.

While it is insinuated that El has "intercourse" with Anat, she continues to be called the "Virgin Anat" throughout the myths. Her virginity is her distinguishing mark, and this motif obviously serves as a precedent archetype upon which the Virgin Mary has been based in significant part. Note also that "Mari" was a popular epithet for the Goddess or a name of a Canaanite goddess many centuries before the Jewish rendition was thus called.

These Canaanite deities were popular and well known, and it is evident that their attributes and myths were passed along to subsequent cultures that spread in various directions. These cultures include the Greeks and, ultimately, Christians.

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PostPosted: Tue Jul 30, 2013 9:24 pm 
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Acharya wrote:
someone commented to the effect that we "still haven't proved Jesus didn't exist."


:D

Acharya wrote:
The factual statement in my opinion - proved beyond a shadow of a doubt - is that the "Jesus Christ" of the New Testament is a fictional composite of characters. A composite of multiple "people" is no one. When the mythological and midrashic layers are removed, there remains no historical core to the onion.


they took our jesus.... DAY TERK ERR JAYSUSSSS!!! :lol: owwww historical Satan is hurting my brain :?


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